Methods For A Screen

[Guest mavatini]

I have just finished building my first home theatre and have tried to save a bit of money on the initial setup by painting the front wall a light grey colour to use as the screen, the picture looks great but should i spend the money to buy a proper screen, will it give me alot better picture.

I can take some pics of the current picture quality if it will help on answering my question.

[dvduser]

I have just finished building my first home theatre and have tried to save a bit of money on the initial setup by painting the front wall a light grey colour to use as the screen, the picture looks great but should i spend the money to buy a proper screen, will it give me alot better picture.

Yes

[yamapro]

A screen will definitely yield you better picture quality than a wall, end of!

That being said budgets are budgets (although they're made to be broken) and a 100" screen that makes use of a friendly wall is still preferable to many than a 42" plasma

Basically if you can afford it a proper HT screen is a fantastic upgrade and would be the first thing I'd want to add in your situation (if the HT side of your system takes precedence to music - which I will assume it does for now )

We have some great local products that really are quite affordable.

OZ Theatre screens are an aussie company and their founder Richard is a contributor round here and very approachable. He will no doubt be glad to help you choose the right screen for your room and your system.

Screen Science screens are also held in high esteem and cater to the budget friendly side of the market.

ScreenTechnics are yet another aussie made product that will offer a good performance/price ratio.

Many people find room in their budget for a screen with the logic that whilst projectors are temporary in nature (more so for digitals than CRTs Gino & Preach - i know) and may well be upgraded or replaced within 2-3 years (or less than one if your like some of our more senior members ) a good screen can form the foundation for your system for 15 years or more and so becomes one of the best value bits of kit in your whole HT system!

It is definitely worth buying a good dedicated, fixed screen (or better yet get an aussiemorphic and custom 'scope screen' for a truly cinematic HT experience!) when the budget allows for it.

If, however the money is tight for a while (and we all know what that's like) one really handy tweak which will DRAMATICALLY improve your viewing experience is this:

Mark out your ideal screen size (four datum points in the corners of a blank screen work well for this) and Paint or assemble a nice matt black frame around this to, well 'frame' your picture. The thicker the better (preferably at least 50 - 60mm thick right up to 200 or 300 if you have the space, WAF etc) and the blacker the better too

The effects are immensely satisfying and instant too! You will perceive great gains in contrast as well as having a 'sharper' feeling, better defined image. You really have to see it to believe the difference a simple frame makes!

Also the light grey is probably a great colour for the remainder of your screen wall, hopefully it too is quite matt (not semi gloss or high sheen) so as to be as non reflective as possible. It may however, be worth painting the screen section of your wall with a brighter more reflective colour than grey, especially if the bulk of your viewing is done at night-time. Most people here will recommend a 'plastic' paint and in a nice brilliant white (Canvas Gesso also works an absolute treat for a cheap and cheerful screen paint) to get the best most vibrant colourful picture

Hope this rant was of some help and Best of Luck mate...

...and may your new hobby not keep you as poor as it has most of our other members! :P

Cheers,

Alex

[Madelaide]

...

Mark out your ideal screen size (four datum points in the corners of a blank screen work well for this) and Paint or assemble a nice matt black frame around this to, well 'frame' your picture. The thicker the better (preferably at least 50 - 60mm thick right up to 200 or 300 if you have the space, WAF etc) and the blacker the better too

The effects are immensely satisfying and instant too! You will perceive great gains in contrast as well as having a 'sharper' feeling, better defined image. You really have to see it to believe the difference a simple frame makes!

Also the light grey is probably a great colour for the remainder of your screen wall, hopefully it too is quite matt (not semi gloss or high sheen) so as to be as non reflective as possible. It may however, be worth painting the screen section of your wall with a brighter more reflective colour than grey, especially if the bulk of your viewing is done at night-time. Most people here will recommend a 'plastic' paint and in a nice brilliant white (Canvas Gesso also works an absolute treat for a cheap and cheerful screen paint) to get the best most vibrant colourful picture

...

Cheers,

Alex

After watching Catalyst on the ABC this week it completely reenforced this view to me. (http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/s1895225.htm)

In summary, the contrast is everything, so the black border is EXTREMELY important for an apparently bright picture, and so too the projector's contrast is equally important for the same reason. (One of the many reasons the JVC HD1 is so good, even though it isn't that bright)

Some of the images on that story, and the researcher's web site truly illustrate the point.

M.

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Quite frankly, I see little benefit in a commercial projector screen over that of a well designed DIY screen made from MDF.

Certainly some commercial screens have a higher gain of about 1.2 which provides the screen with a brighter image, but that can be easily done with a fixed horizontally curved MDF screen painted with a white flat plastic having a high level titanium dioxide.

Unless one wants to have a mobile screen, a roll-up or retractable screen , an acoustically transparent screen, there is little to be gained from that of a good DIY screen.

Framing the perimeter of the screen with a broad black border IS very important to enhancing the image's visual impact .

In addition to that if one can install the projector with its lens centre to centre with the screen and then horizontally curving the screen a little this will give an increase in brightness and sharpness as the screen reflects the image back more directly to the viewer.

The curvature of the screen can be determined by projecting a finely detailed test pattern on to the flat screen and then gently curving it until the test pattern is entirely sharp across the screen to the outer edges.

Even if the change in sharpness is small one might also see some degree of improvement in convergence, certainly there will be an increase in brightness.

Note that the curve of the screen is quite small but the improvement is worthwhile and easily accomplished without creating any visual distortion to the image, in fact a flat screen does not follow the profile of the lens and thus is not optimal.

A pure white screen is best suited to the typical LCD projectors used in of Home Theatre, if the projector has a high brightness level a light grey screen might be more suitable.

C.M

[Guest mavatini]

Thanks for all you help guys, will take everything into consideration, and as money permits i will look into something which will help my viewing experience.

Nice to see a forum that doesn't belittle questions that may seem obvious to some.

Thanks again for your help and look forward to being an active member here.

[AndrewW]

Just wanted to back up the Chicken Man's comments.

I made a screen out of a timber frame and 100% blockout material from spotlight.

Covered the frame in black velour look alike, and the results are fantastic.

Cost me about $110 and a few hours of hard work.

OK, so a $2500 screen might look better, but 25 times better ? I don't think so.

To be honest, I think the image on mine actually looks better than what I saw on some $1000+ screens.

Andrew.

[The_Preacher1973]

Just wanted to back up the Chicken Man's comments.

I made a screen out of a timber frame and 100% blockout material from spotlight.

Covered the frame in black velour look alike, and the results are fantastic.

Cost me about $110 and a few hours of hard work.

OK, so a $2500 screen might look better, but 25 times better ? I don't think so.

To be honest, I think the image on mine actually looks better than what I saw on some $1000+ screens.

Andrew.

And just to completely confuse the issue I'll add my opinion.

I've used both a professional screen (OZTS Majestic with the older 1.2 gain fabric - not the newer EVO3D) and the spotlight BO cloth as well. My experience is the exact opposite of Andrew's. The professional screen (which I bought for about $500) is way better than the homemade BO cloth.

I think the difference may be that my projector's are a bit more "lumenally challenged" than the current digital PJ's. As such the 0.8 gain of the BO material is just too low for my PJ's with low light output to produce a punchy picture on a 100" screen.

No one screen is going to be the best choice in every situation.

I will say this though. I was surprised at how good the BO cloth was. If you're looking to do something on the cheap and have a high lumen PJ then it could be worth it. Personally though for the amount of time it would take me to build a $120 home made screen, I'll pay $500 for something like the OZTS Majestic any day of the week.

You pays your money and makes your choice.

[quijibo]

When I first got my projector I had it projecting on to a wall painted cream with a medium gloss paint. The image was quite bright and suffered from a little bit of hot spotting but it looked superb.

I was considering repainting it, but I won a cheap screen on ebay. I wasn't expecting too much but when I put the screen up in front of the wall I noticed a massive difference. The image was a little less bright, but so much more natural looking.

The screen only cost me about $90 delivered, so there are even cheaper options that don't have to repaired when you move the projector.

The only downside is that the screen is cheap and has a few ruffles in it, but you don't notice them while a movie is playing.

[ramius]

Preacher

Was thay BO screen painted. I have 2 DIY screens - one plain BO and one BO painted with gesso. The former is pretty ordinary but the painted screen is excellent.

Cheers

Bill

[The_Preacher1973]

Preacher

Was thay BO screen painted. I have 2 DIY screens - one plain BO and one BO painted with gesso. The former is pretty ordinary but the painted screen is excellent.

Cheers

Bill

The material I used had some sort of white acryllic sprayed on one side of the material. I'm sure it would have looked OK for a digital PJ. It just didn't work very well with my CRT's.

[dkmaj]

can someone advise me furher on gesso, where to buy, how much, how to apply, what color to use for screen applciations...thanks

[yamapro]

Sure can

Gesso is what is used to prime canvass before painting. You can buy it at any art supply store and should only cost $15 or so for enough to do an average screen you can apply it with a brush, roller or if thinned with water a spray gun. The colour choice is easy as i believe it only comes in Brilliant White... your welcome.

It is a GREAT budget solution and made a huge difference on my first set-up compared to just a normal painted wall. It will probably not have the measure of even a cheapie $500 screen but then again you are comparing $15 with $500 - don't forget a nice thick black border to get the most out of it

[dkmaj]

Sure can

Gesso is what is used to prime canvass before painting. You can buy it at any art supply store and should only cost $15 or so for enough to do an average screen you can apply it with a brush, roller or if thinned with water a spray gun. The colour choice is easy as i believe it only comes in Brilliant White... your welcome.

It is a GREAT budget solution and made a huge difference on my first set-up compared to just a normal painted wall. It will probably not have the measure of even a cheapie $500 screen but then again you are comparing $15 with $500 - don't forget a nice thick black border to get the most out of it

thanks for that, i just like the bugger around factor of dyi screens, done 3 now, and may in the near future do another with BO and gesso, so might grab some and have a plaY!!

[ramius]

Preacher

As it happens i am also a CRT user (XG). For various reasons I am still using an old commercial Screen Technics - which is admittedly not exactly state of the art - but my Gesso screen is definately better than that.

DKMAJ

I used Artist Spectrum gesso which was the stuff of choice at the time (high titanium etc ) and a little flowtrol (sp?) to aid self levelling and hence ensure no visible roller marks etc. Foam roller seems very effective BTW.

Cheers

Bill

[The_Preacher1973]

Preacher

As it happens i am also a CRT user (XG). For various reasons I am still using an old commercial Screen Technics - which is admittedly not exactly state of the art - but my Gesso screen is definately better than that.

DKMAJ

I used Artist Spectrum gesso which was the stuff of choice at the time (high titanium etc ) and a little flowtrol (sp?) to aid self levelling and hence ensure no visible roller marks etc. Foam roller seems very effective BTW.

Cheers

Bill

Fair enough. I didn't paint the BO cloth. I just used the side that had the white acryllic pre sprayed on it.

Also, your XG has about twice the light ouput of my GP and about 20% more than my Sim2.

[Dexx1503560195]

Gesso is what is used to prime canvass before painting. You can buy it at any art supply store and should only cost $15 or so for enough to do an average screen you can apply it with a brush, roller or if thinned with water a spray gun. The colour choice is easy as i believe it only comes in Brilliant White... your welcome.

I'm trying to decide whether to make my screen from a painted MDF board or block out fabric stretched over a frame.

Is Gesso a brand name? Or is it a type of paint? Does anyone else have recommendations for good screen paints available in

Australia?

[ramius]

I suspect blockout over a frame will give a better result. Try AVSforum for more guidance. There are particular methods for stretchinf the material so you don't get wrinkles.

Gesso is a type of paint - Artist Spectrum as mentioned above was a preferred brand at one point. Because it is a base for paintng it is supposed to be a true white. Also its easy to apply and with Flowtrol and a cheap foam roller you won't get any application marks at all.

Bill

[AndrewW]

Try AVSforum for more guidance. There are particular methods for stretchinf the material so you don't get wrinkles.

Yep, there are some great threads on avsforum explaining DIY screens.

I used it to make mine, and it turned out great.

My major piece of advice would be to splash out on an electric staple gun, I bought one for $60 from bunnings and it made life so much simpler. I would hate to think of the hand cramps after using a manual staple gun to put in over 200 staples.

All up, including the gun, it still cost me well under $200.

Andrew.

Andrew.

[Blownpixel]

This issue is about diminishing returns; the level of performance you can get from entry level versus the manufactured screens.

But it is also about restricting your HT experience to the visual alone - and if that is your performance objective than yes almost anything will get you an eye pleasing picture to some degree if the screen material is carefully matched to your room, viewing position, ambient light level and projector light output.

However, one of the areas that many home-made screens fail is in the area of cloth/MDF is fabric uniformity - it is an area where you can return manufactured screens and may be worth considering if you don't want to deal with that 'area on my screen which isn't as bright as the rest'...

There is also a far larger issue to consider; if you just want a big picture why don't you just buy an big LCD screen - (this is a wider thread to consider).

The reason to use projection is because you can go bigger while emulating the performance environment of film. And if that is your objective, then you should be aiming for audio-visual coherenecy - ie an acoustically transparent screen - there are many simple solutions you can use here (SMX) and it does set entry level systems apart from those that are cinematically focused.

It comes down to planning your system from the beginning and sticking to a specified performance outcome.

Remember; The most important acoustic component in your system (after the room) is the screen.

Incidentally if you do want to make a simple frame this guy in NZ wrote this;

http://www.audioenz.co.nz/2007/frame.shtml

[c912039]

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Why do I get that sudden feeling of dread returning....

[Tweet]

Double entry.

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Why do I get that sudden feeling of dread returning....

Let's hope he has learnt from his old condescending and nitpicking views and not be so contentious as in the past.

Here's to a 'refurbished pixel'.......... .....cheers.

C.M

Edit :.....I happened to pick this thread first before reading any of his other contributions of late.

Maybe I am being optimistic.

[AndrewW]

ie an acoustically transparent screen -

get off your freaking high horse

Incidentally if you do want to make a simple frame this guy in NZ wrote this;

lol ... this guy ... umm you mean you, right ?

Andrew.

[AndrewW]

Maybe I am being optimistic.

Way, way too optimistic.

Where's Bitey when we need him ?

Andrew.