Harveys And Westcoast Hide Toshiba Hd-dvd

[Hussla]

The reality is, very few people really give a flying **** about either Blu-Ray or HD-DVD atm.

Contrasted to the pre-release hype for DVD.

Now going even further, most people know what Blu-ray is, the reality it has been marketed **** loads better than HD-DVD has been, most people dont know what HD-DVD is, in fact alot of my customers didnt even know there was another format.

As far as im concerned Blu-ray has already won, simply because it has been marketed far better and I dont want to say that, because I am not a Sony fan by any means.

Toshibas Australian marketing is pathetic, I dont think they have gone into this full heartedly and it was stupid they just didnt go with the blu-ray camp like most other companies did in the first place...

of course thats just purely my opinion.

[Skid_MacMarx]

So don't be anxious for the lack of presentation of HD DVD in the shops, Blu-ray barely raises an eyebrow even with all the advertising and promotion it has had.

I don't know about that CM...

From what I saw, the PS3 demo was stopping people at myer the other day

It actually blew me away. . .

[aafuss]

I've also seen the American Sony Blu-Ray player at the Bundall Harvey store.

[Tweet]

Now that we are only weeks away from when Toshiba Australia take over the reigns from Castel, marketing of HD DVD needs to be in earnest in order promote HD DVD as the cheaper option.

Also Toshiba should provide a lower introductory price for these 2nd generation machines in order to attract interest, at least for a few months, to offset the previous poor advertising campaign by Castel.

Skid, I have no doubt the PS3 can deliver an eye captivating image and is simply stunning but before long even that is not enough to convince mums and dads to part with a $1000 bucks for a games machine for the kids.

You may well be the exception though.

C.M

[Skid_MacMarx]

Also Toshiba should provide an lower introductory price for these 2nd generation machines in order to attract interest, at least for a few months, to offset the previous poor advertising campaign.by Castel.

..

Toshiba announces cheapest ever UK HD DVD player

Toshiba has announced a third HD DVD player for the European market. The HD-EP10, which will go on sale in May priced at 449 pounds, matches the already available HD-E1 in general specification and finish, but adds a 1080p video output.

http://avzombie.com/blog/2007/03/15/toshib...-hd-dvd-player/

[Hussla]

$449 pounds is approx $1095 aus...

[Tweet]

$449 pounds is approx $1095 aus...

Well that's $4 cheaper than the E1 ..........can't complain about that !

C.M

[Hussla]

Personally I think its waste of money for 1st/2nd gen technology.

The way I look at it, i'd rather wait for the lemmings to jump first, I prefer waiting till there is at least one format dominating and the bugs have been more ironed out.

At the end of the day thought I wouldnt bet on the HD-DVD horse, not with it technical limitations, lack of industry support and the poor marketing of the product.

As I mentioned early, when people come into the shop asking, most people either know or have some idea of blu-ray, but as for HD-DVD, it generally draws a blank stare.

Either way one can throw they money at beta testing products or one can wait till the war is over.

[kamma]

Personally I think its waste of money for 1st/2nd gen technology.

The way I look at it, i'd rather wait for the lemmings to jump first, I prefer waiting till there is at least one format dominating and the bugs have been more ironed out.

At the end of the day thought I wouldnt bet on the HD-DVD horse, not with it technical limitations, lack of industry support and the poor marketing of the product.

As I mentioned early, when people come into the shop asking, most people either know or have some idea of blu-ray, but as for HD-DVD, it generally draws a blank stare.

Either way one can throw they money at beta testing products or one can wait till the war is over.

what are hd-dvd's technical limitations you peak of?

[Hussla]

what are hd-dvd's technical limitations you peak of?

The main limitation im referring to is theoretical maxium capacity, BD claims to be able to deliver a 50gb disk, whereas HD-DVD claims it can deliver a triple layer 45gb disc.

Whether or not these claims will be substantiated are another story.

[Tweet]

Personally I think its waste of money for 1st/2nd gen technology.

The way I look at it, i'd rather wait for the lemmings to jump first, I prefer waiting till there is at least one format dominating and the bugs have been more ironed out.

At the end of the day thought I wouldnt bet on the HD-DVD horse, not with it technical limitations, lack of industry support and the poor marketing of the product.

As I mentioned early, when people come into the shop asking, most people either know or have some idea of blu-ray, but as for HD-DVD, it generally draws a blank stare.

Either way one can throw they money at beta testing products or one can wait till the war is over.

As I see it, Sony is betting their format's success on a games machine's market acceptance and not on a dedicated product.

One has to ask where is this huge support of their co-manufacturers of Blu-ray machines in the marketplace ?

What have we seen over here...... the Samsung and the Panasonic.

The Samsung is now having loading problems with the draw , hardly a drawcard.

The Panasonic is outrageously priced beyond market expectations and still waiting upgrades.

Both are first generation machines to boot.

The LG multi-format player is fraught with inconsistencies,thankfully not over here yet I hope .

So seeing that, I hardly think Toshiba's HD DVD is in trouble given the quality of their product line.

But I do agree Toshiba Australia do need to do some heavy promotion of HD DVD in the coming weeks ,and even offer an incentive discount.

C.M

[Highjinx]

what are hd-dvd's technical limitations you peak of?

Peak bandwidth along with space perhaps.........but you knew that already!

[kamma]

The main limitation im referring to is theoretical maxium capacity, BD claims to be able to deliver a 50gb disk, whereas HD-DVD claims it can deliver a triple layer 45gb disc.

Whether or not these claims will be substantiated are another story.

hd-dvd;s triple layer discs are actually 51gb, three layers of 17gb per layer and should be out by the end of the year with full back compatibility (firmware update) to all hd-dvd players.

[Highjinx]

hd-dvd;s triple layer discs are actually 51gb, three layers of 17gb per layer and should be out by the end of the year with full back compatibility (firmware update) to all hd-dvd players.

It's only speculation at the moment. The specification has not even been finalised let alone submitted to the HD-DVD forum for approval.

Link

From Amir of MS: 17/03/2007

"TL-51 can of course move through the forum. How easy it would be to do that, depends on the spec. I have not seen the TL-51 specifications so I have no real data to give you. But the forum has approved many variations of HD DVD format already so there is pretty good structure for evaluating and approving it."

Of course it could be submitted shortly and developed and marketed.

TL51 APPEARS TO REQUIRE NEW PLAYERS BY INFORMATION AVAILABLE THUS FAR

This question by Darinp2 has gone unanswered by Amir.......

I would love to see HD DVD require TL-51 with 1.5x spin rate support for all future players (Gen1s being allowed an exception if required). There was a press release recently about a Chinese format where the only major difference was said to be the codecs used, with the same discs used for it as HD DVD. Looks to me like the same drives could be used for both formats if things stay like that. Do you expect the requirements for players for both formats to change so that they have to support TL-51s, the requirements for only HD DVD players to change so they have to support TL-51s (thus creating another difference between the 2 formats), or for neither format to require players to support TL-51s?

--Darin

[kamma]

It's only speculation at the moment. The specification has not even been finalised let alone submitted to the HD-DVD forum for approval.

Link

From Amir of MS: 17/03/2007

Of course it could be submitted shortly and developed and marketed.

TL51 APPEARS TO REQUIRE NEW PLAYERS BY INFORMATION AVAILABLE THUS FAR

This question by Darinp2 has gone unanswered by Amir.......

this has been discussed on another thread ( i cant find it right now ) extensively and from memory it was spoken that it may require a faster spin rate and even you said that via a firmware upgrade the spin rate could be changed

[Hussla]

As I see it, Sony is betting their format's success on a games machine's market acceptance and not on a dedicated product.

One has to ask where is this huge support of their co-manufacturers of Blu-ray machines in the marketplace ?

What have we seen over here...... the Samsung and the Panasonic.

The Samsung is now having loading problems with the draw , hardly a drawcard.

The Panasonic is outrageously priced beyond market expectations and still waiting upgrades.

Both are first generation machines to boot.

The LG multi-format player is fraught with inconsistencies,thankfully not over here yet I hope .

So seeing that, I hardly think Toshiba's HD DVD is in trouble given the quality of their product line.

But I do agree Toshiba Australia do need to do some heavy promotion of HD DVD in the coming weeks ,and even offer an incentive discount.

C.M

Well considering Pioneer, Sony, Samsung & Panasonic already have players out in the market (not necessarily here) and Toshiba is the only one out with a HD-DVD player, along with the xbox360's add-on.

Looking at the number of big studios who have signed with blu-ray only and so far much fewer have signed with HD-DVD.

[Highjinx]

this has been discussed on another thread ( i cant find it right now ) extensively and from memory it was spoken that it may require a faster spin rate and even you said that via a firmware upgrade the spin rate could be changed

I said the third layer reading may be a possibility, then I went back and corrected my earlier statement as increasing the spin speed to 1.5x can't be done on older gen players as an increase in bandwidth of the data path would be required. This cannot be changed via firmware....requires a whole new hardware redesign. So the new disks would be of little value use on the older players.

[MeWhoElse]

I said the third layer reading may be a possibility, then I went back and corrected my earlier statement as increasing the spin speed to 1.5x can't be done on older gen players as an increase in bandwidth of the data path would be required. This cannot be changed via firmware....requires a whole new hardware redesign. So the new disks would be of little value use on the older players.

Strange that... I've managed to "flash" the firmware on my DVD drives for the PC, and offered immediately faster read write spin rates... Just because the software to control the mechanical does not support that speed... do you think the mechanical can not support that speed?

Think about it...

[Hussla]

I said the third layer reading may be a possibility, then I went back and corrected my earlier statement as increasing the spin speed to 1.5x can't be done on older gen players as an increase in bandwidth of the data path would be required. This cannot be changed via firmware....requires a whole new hardware redesign. So the new disks would be of little value use on the older players.

Isnt that just due to short-sightedness during the design process? and in a way be a slap in the face for people who forked out dollars for the early gen units.

Heck I've got a A Panasonic DVD player I got in 1999 (mid 99 model) and it'll still play just about all new discs, aside from the fact it's laser is on the blink and it has gotten very cranky in its old age, I really never had any compatibility issues with it.

[Highjinx]

Strange that... I've managed to "flash" the firmware on my DVD drives for the PC, and offered immediately faster read write spin rates... Just because the software to control the mechanical does not support that speed... do you think the mechanical can not support that speed?

Think about it...

You have a point, spinning the drive faster is one thing, but was the increase in data bandwidth already catered for in drive electronics of your DVD drive, the ATA interface say ATA66/100/133 knowing very well that these specifiactions were in the pipeline.

Interesting that it wrote faster as well, because an increase in laser intensity would have been required. Perhaps your drive was indeed designed with the faster ATA interfaces in mind and firmware down graded to suit the market segment.

Is this the same as for HD-DVD and it's design limitations? Your talking about a bandwidth increase of 50%.

If it was the way you say, people like Amir would have come out and said it by now, knowing full well the positive impact of this possibility for HD-DVD. Not to mention Toshiba screaming this from the hill tops!

I know single layer DVD drives that were flashed to read the second layer....but these were designed initially with DL in mind.

Isnt that just due to short-sightedness during the design process? and in a way be a slap in the face for people who forked out dollars for the early gen units.

Heck I've got a A Panasonic DVD player I got in 1999 (mid 99 model) and it'll still play just about all new discs, aside from the fact it's laser is on the blink and it has gotten very cranky in its old age, I really never had any compatibility issues with it.

The HD-DVD specification was rushed to get to the market before BR. Amir has stated he thinks that TL51 will suppliment the disk mix, I feel with new players....could be wrong though. Great for current owners, if it can be done and used with existing players.

The DVD spec has not changed since it's inception...that I am aware of...DL was always part of the spec.

[AndrewW]

From what I saw, the PS3 demo was stopping people at myer the other day

How many people did you see whacking down their grand in cash for a pre-order ?

[momaw]

How many people did you see whacking down their grand in cash for a pre-order ?

and that's the crux of the matter isn't it. "Nice picture that on a $4000 plus screen."

The common response is "Meh".

Even the formats biggest proponent on this forum has not put money down on it and has no intention to any time soon.

[franin]

you know what, its not the samsung, nor the panasonic,nor toshiba but it's the ps3 thats going to introduce the australian public to the new hd format. Why? you ask, because it's being pushed by Harvey Norman. Most of the public that I know think harvey Norman is ahead of the rest in just about every technological aspect. Harvey Norman tells them what the new dvd format to buy,Harvey Norman tell them the best audio setup, etc etc. We all hear know that most of the guys that work there don't care or have a clue, but still for most thats where there going to buy there plasmas/lcd's/projectors/dvd players etc. It's funny really when you think about it but it's like Harvery Norman decides what goes and stays.The other audio shops deal with more specialist gear for people like ourselves but in deciding and promoting the new format they really don't have much of say.Harvey Norman pushes the ps3 in your face and it has everybody curious.If they pushed hd-dvd like they are doing the ps3, you will notice that hd-dvd will be in everybody's vocabulary.But because they don't no one has heard of them. HN does this by offering 4 years intrest free, which makes them the number 1 shop. Who wouldn't listen to them. Apart from all of us, which we are a minority we decide for ourselves, and we go the specialist shop to purchase most of our audio gear.

[Hussla]

you know what, its not the samsung, nor the panasonic,nor toshiba but it's the ps3 thats going to introduce the australian public to the new hd format. Why? you ask, because it's being pushed by Harvey Norman. Most of the public that I know think harvey Norman is ahead of the rest in just about every technological aspect. Harvey Norman tells them what the new dvd format to buy,Harvey Norman tell them the best audio setup, etc etc. We all hear know that most of the guys that work there don't care or have a clue, but still for most thats where there going to buy there plasmas/lcd's/projectors/dvd players etc. It's funny really when you think about it but it's like Harvery Norman decides what goes and stays.The other audio shops deal with more specialist gear for people like ourselves but in deciding and promoting the new format they really don't have much of say.Harvey Norman pushes the ps3 in your face and it has everybody curious.If they pushed hd-dvd like they are doing the ps3, you will notice that hd-dvd will be in everybody's vocabulary.But because they don't no one has heard of them. HN does this by offering 4 years intrest free, which makes them the number 1 shop. Who wouldn't listen to them. Apart from all of us, which we are a minority we decide for ourselves, and we go the specialist shop to purchase most of our audio gear.

Jesus some people on this forum are so pathetic and pety that will resort to any level to take a dig at Harvey Norman, get over it!!!

Either way, from HN's perspective it's a wiser and more sure bet, betting on Blu-ray, lets see how many major studios are supporting blu-ray exclusively with releases ?

I've been to a couple of retravision and Powerhouses and I didn't even catch a glimpse of a HD-DVD player, but I saw much in the way of Blu-ray....so there goes your little conspiracy theory!

And too right the PS3 will introduce it to the aust public....and guess what?

Harvey Norman didnt invent the PS3 nor are they the only company selling them...! woah! bet you didn't know that!

You know many specialist computer outlets, etc will be selling ps3's too?

So seriously dude get your head out of your ass and write a letter to Gerry Harvey if you dislike them so much! Not everybody has the money to shop at specialist outlets and hence why there is a pilgrimate to places like HN that offer deferred payment deals because their poor and cant afford to pay upfront! HN and most other "BOX" mover type places dont cater to the specialist arena, whom have always gone to specialist places and pay the desserving premium they charge for the extra quality service, nothing new there! I happen to know one of the specialist outlets in Geelong quite well and would gladly buy from them at any time because their knoweldge and expertise is well worth it.

Sorry to be rude and sarcastic dude it's not personal but im sick of reading people here **** about HN like they are the anti-christ and blaming them about everything from the Iraq War to the drought and even interest rate rises!

Ive shopped at many different outlets you get smart and dumbass salesdrones wherever you go....Powerhouse are the worst, most are just kids who wouldnt know the difference between "NO SIGNAL" on a projector and a blown lamp ahahahhah

[momaw]

I've been to a couple of retravision and Powerhouses and I didn't even catch a glimpse of a HD-DVD player, but I saw much in the way of Blu-ray....so there goes your little conspiracy theory!

Really, they don't even stock blu-ray here in those stores (or HD DVD for that matter).