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Will we see SONY DVDR with digital tuner in Oz?


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Looks like such a beast has now been released in the UK - the SONY RDR GX500 (has an inbuilt digital tuner). Will we get this in Australia?

I know we have some unique digital tv system but I would love to be able to record digital tv as digital signals to a DVD (and not by using a Topfield, a computer, editing time etc etc,.

See link:

http://www.avreview.co.uk/news/article.asp?UAN=82

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pity the 500 model with the digital tuner don't have a hdd in it. Don't know I I'd want to record straight off fta to a dvd - think I'd want to go to hdd and only put the stuff on dvd that I want to archive away or watch on another display.

We'll get there one day!....

no if only the sony dvdr with hdd have component in I could hook up a sd dvb tuner to it.

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hi...there are several things about this topic that I wonder if some folks are considering...Now I'm not saying I am right here...just putting up some points for discussion.

1/The Sony with the digital tuner only has one tuner...and therefore no better than a Strong in that regard, (with the Topfield being a much better choice), except that it can burn a DVD, at reduced quality than what comes off the HDD of say ....the Topfield

2/Any recording either to the HDD or DVD is done with converted signal, so that any writing to a disk so that it will play in any DVD recorder wont be any different to using a DVD recorder like the Panasonic, and a set top box.

3/ You cant record digital bitstream direct to a DVD because any players that are different to the recorder/player would not play it.

3/The ideal setup would still be a Topfield PVR recorder in combination with a DVD recorder.

4/The quality of picture that you would get at anything less than 4Mbps would be crap...so if you got 125 hours recording on the drive, it would still be of a lesser quality than a Topfield which delivers TV signal exactly as it is intended, and not reduced and converted.

5/If you were able to record direct to a DVD you would only get about 1.5 hours of digital TV on a DVD disc, with the bit stream rates being what they are in Australia

6/ On top of all that are the copyright restrictions that are applied in Australia, and its doubtful that you will be allowed to record movies direct to a DVD from these Sony's...copyright restrictions are already happening here...

I will say that I don't have any technical knowledge or inside knowledge here...These are just my thoughts on the topic when thinking about it logically and I stress that I am not saying I am right here...just typing as I am thinking

In case you don't see what the ideal purchase would be, it is a Topfield in combination with a DVD recorder....If you want to burn on the computer thats fine...

foss

Looks like such a beast has now been released in the UK - the SONY RDR GX500 (has an inbuilt digital tuner). Will we get this in Australia?

I know we have some unique digital tv system but I would love to be able to record digital tv as digital signals to a DVD (and not by using a Topfield, a computer, editing time etc etc,.

See link:

http://www.avreview.co.uk/news/article.asp?UAN=82

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Why do you say you can only record to DVD at reduced quality?

I have been transferring recordings to DVD without recoding on a regular basis. I do it with captured bitstreams on my PC (and I note the original post said he didn't want to use a PC).

The signal needs to be converted from .MPV to .MPG format but this in no way changes the bitstream, only the way the MPEG2 file is organised

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Hi...Like I said, I am only expressing some thoughts, but here are some more...

You are talking about processing on a computer...the Sony will only be taking the signal it would normally sent to a TV and record it at various speeds, and anything recorded at a rate of less than 4Mbps is of a lesser quality than is played by PVR's such as the Topfield.

The signal recorded to the DVD disk would be that which is sent to the TV but at a set bit rate.....The PVR's record and send at whatever rate they receive it at and all sound streams are kept as well as captions...

I am probably a little out of my depth here discussing this, but please remember that the topic was about a digital tuner in a DVD recorder, and what I was saying was that a Topfield with its twin tuners and a DVD recorder would offer more options than the Top of the line Sony DVD recorder.

I will leave it at that for now

foss

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The very fact that these Sony's would be able to record a digital source and re-encode it at variable bit rates using a completely digital signal path would blow your alternative out of the water. For both technical & usablility reasons.

Your example of 4mbps encoding being crap (in order to get 2hrs+ of Aussie TV on a DVDR) is debatable... This is often the case with simple compression algorithms. however sony say they are using some powerful enoding algorithms that reduce the impact on image quality. Of course our eyes will give the final verdict.

For what its worth you also wouldn't have a hope in hell of selling a Toppy/DVD Recorder alternative to the general consumer once devices like the sony are available here - twin tuner or not.

Its just a matter of time before the initial copyright limitations are going to be "solved".... look at DVD Region coding for instance. :blink::P

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Twin tuner ability overrides many things in my opinion and until you have experienced twin tuner recording you will have no idea how good it is....

Please note that I said anything less than 4MBPS would be crap...not 4MBPS...4Mbps would have a similar quality to SD TV...if that

If you are not getting the quality that SD TV gives then in my opinion(and mine only) I would consider it not good enough...The Topfield delivers exactly the same quality as a high quality STB, which is what it is...The PQ of recordings done at less than 4Mbps could not deliver SD TV quality.

Could you explain what technical and usability reasons would blow my alternative out of the water....Variable bitrate recording on one tuner is hardly blowing twin tuner everything recorded out of the water...Does the Sony record all sound and captions tracks...don't think so.

My alternative is a suggestion to use till something like the Sony gets here, but unless it had twin tuners I certainly would not be interested...

the Sony will never take the place of units like the Topfield

At the moment the cost of the Sony here in Australia would be in excess of $2400

You could but 2 Topfields and a very good DVD recorder for that price!!!

foss

The very fact that these Sony's would be able to record a digital source and re-encode it at variable bit rates using a completely digital signal path would blow your alternative out of the water. For both technical & usablility reasons.

Your example of 4mbps encoding being crap  (in order to get 2hrs+ of Aussie TV on a DVDR) is debatable... This is often the case with simple compression algorithms. however sony say they are using some powerful enoding algorithms that reduce the impact on image quality. Of course our eyes will give the final verdict.

For what its worth you also wouldn't have a hope in hell of selling a Toppy/DVD Recorder alternative to the general consumer once devices like the sony are available here - twin tuner or not.

Its just a matter of time before the initial copyright limitations are going to be "solved".... look at DVD Region coding for instance.  :blink:  :P

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I like to add to the Sony recorders.

Recently, I have seen these models first hand at the Sony Tower in Japan. I was rather impressed with the HD/hours capablilties and the week long EPG data (already in use). Also on demostration, I loved the 9ft+ wide Wega LCD TV screen. I spent too much time in the Sony centre, I had to be dragged out.

Anyway, the Sony DVD/HD range is not my cup of tea, the DVD aspect is now quite primitive for SDTV or HDTV recording. But on the other hand video compression is making inroads and it is becoming hard to tell the difference in picture quality to the lazy eye.

These new Sony DVD/HD models will quickly become redundant, just around the corner are the dual layer (9G) and blue ray laser (27G) DVD's which they are becoming more common.

With the Toppy's twin tuners - you are in control of your TV, it's the best thing since sliced bread. I agree with Foss comments how bloody good twin tuners are!.

Pep.

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pity the 500 model with the digital tuner don't have a hdd in it. Don't know I I'd want to record straight off fta to a dvd - think I'd want to go to hdd and only put the stuff on dvd that I want to archive away or watch on another display.

We'll get there one day!....

no if only the sony dvdr with hdd have component in I could hook up a sd dvb tuner to it.

My Sony RDR-GX7 has RGB in via scart, and i use the Emtech 1150 Scart to Scart with it, great quality. :blink:

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>Could you explain what technical and usability reasons would blow my alternative out of the water....

1) Technical -> Direct Digital path (ie: no D/A -> A/D ) recording to DVD with variable bit rates, with DD5.1

2) Usability -> 1 remote, 1 box, 1 manual, Less cables - easier to install, you dont need to be an enthusiast to be able to use it. People dont want their entertainment units to look like a cockpit.

>At the moment the cost of the Sony here in Australia would be in excess of $2400

Nope. Current street pricing in the UK is approx AU$950 - dont forget you are also getting a DVD player with progressive output.

> Twin tuner ability overrides many things in my opinion

With a sample size of only 5 channels to choose from in Oz I cant see the average user (the other 99.9% not on this forum) impacted by only having a single tuner very often.

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I'm sorry...if you are not going to be realistic here, there is really no point in me discussing it...

To say that the street price is AU $950 when that web page quotes it at 899 pound which converts to $2275 AUD is not realistic, plus some other points you are being anti Toppy about, such as it is obvious you don't have twin tuners because you cant see a need for them....You would not be making that comment if you had used twin SD digital tuners...

anyway...this topic is going nowhere...all I was doing was offering an alternative, because Digital tuners in a DVD recorder ain't gonna happen here, and if it does there will be severe restrictions on what you can copy to DVD...there already is.......I wont be posting anymore on this topic.

foss

>Could you explain what technical and usability reasons would blow my alternative out of the water....

1) Technical -> Direct Digital path (ie: no D/A -> A/D ) recording to DVD with variable bit rates, with DD5.1

2) Usability -> 1 remote, 1 box, 1 manual, Less cables - easier to install, you dont need to be an enthusiast to be able to use it. People dont want their entertainment units to look like a cockpit.

>At the moment the cost of the Sony here in Australia would be in excess of $2400

Nope. Current street pricing in the UK is approx AU$950 - dont forget you are also getting a DVD player with progressive output.

> Twin tuner ability overrides many things in my opinion

With a sample size of only 5 channels to choose from in Oz I cant see the average user (the other 99.9% not on this forum) impacted by only having a single tuner very often.

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I think your looking up the wrong part number, the Sony unit with freeview and DVD Recorder is RDR-DGX500 and the RRP is 499 squid. A quick google came up with some selling for as low as 375.

Its obvious you dont want to hear what I reckon but check these recording specs out.....

Record time (4.7 GB DVD) - multiply by 2 for 9.4 GB double sided disc - approximate: (32 steps) Format HQ HSP SP LP EP SLP

Time (mins) 60 90 120 180 240 360

Here is the source http://www.superfi.co.uk/index.cfm/page/mo...Product_ID/2028

ps: Ive owned the TF5000PVR for 6 months - :blink:

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I think i'm going to be waiting till a dual layer dvdr burner comes out - 60min at HQ is way to short for me and I not going to be turning over to the otherside when one sides full - I'm pretty happy just doing that with my record player.

fossil I agree to a certain extent with what your saying. Till we have a vcr replacement (dvdr with a HDD and inbuilt digital tuner) I think a dvdr and a pvr is a pretty good option.

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