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Pixilation will be exaggerated by the SVM or edge enhancement that the Hitachi does by default.

Edge enhancement needs to be reduced in the service menu.

The sharpness control can also be used to minimize this problem, so try turning sharpness down.

The TV can be set to display in standard 576i, 576i 100Hz, 576p (Progressive) or 1080i (Virtual HD).

I recommend you use the Virtual HD mode.

Owen,

I had the opportunity to view the C57-WD5000 at Harvey Norman the other day, side by side with a slightly smaller plasma, both showing Bugs Life.

The Hitachi picture was very dark and terribly aliased in comparison to the plasma.

Whilst I'm sure the Hitachi could be tweaked to be much better and I suspect the salesdroids have purposefully downgraded the image so as to cast the plasma in a better light, what would cause the aliasing appearance? I thought the Hitachi had a Faroudja de-interlacer, or maybe I have mis-heard specifications.

The very reflective screen was the main thing that disappointed: I thought the basic image had potential.

Is the Hitachi capable of better than 50/60Hz and can you offer any comments on how the Virtual HD works and why you recommend it?

Ian

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Ian,

First of all, if you are not the kind of person who likes to tinker and is prepared to do the calibration work that is required to get the best out a CRT RPTV, then buy a digital RPTV or a Plasma.

Also if the reflective screen surface will be a problem, stick to models that have anti reflective screens.

If I have not discouraged you yet, then a CRT RPTV may be for you.

Be assured that a correctly set up Hitachi 57” HD RPTV will outperform a 60” Plasma.

Pay no attention to the dreadful picture that you see in a retail showroom as VERY few CRT RPTV’s look good in a retailer and the Hitachi looks worse than many, as it’s default setup really sucks.

Having a good clean upscaled source is VERY important in getting the best out of any big screen when viewed from close distances. A HTPC or maybe an external scaler processor is highly recommended.

You may have noticed people complaining about not being able to view a 50” HD Plasma from 2.5 meters due to poor picture quality. Well I view my 57” from 2.8 meters and have amazing picture quality with good HD source and very good quality with DVD’s, partly due to the HTPC I use to upscale.

99.5% of people have never seen a properly set up CRT RPTV and can have absolutely no idea of how good they can be.

Unfortunately, unlike the US, where CRT RPTV’s are very widely used and professional calibration services are readily available, I am not aware of anyone offering this service in Australia.

The Hitachi has a 100Hz mode and a 576p mode, but I find the virtual HD mode that upscales SD input to 1080i looks much better.

The 100Hz mode and 576p mode are still only PAL standard 576 lines and that is just not enough to cover a 57” screen without visible scan lines. 1080i is the way to go for a good picture on the Hitachi.

Regards,

Owen

P.S. If you are serious and live in Sydney, you could come and see my Hitachi in action and become one of the 0.5 %. :blink:

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Owen,

According to the Imaging Science website, there are 2 in australia:

Pro Image Media Systems Lockleys, SA

Weststate Audio Video Systems Maida Vale

I cant find any reference to 'pro image' here in SA - ive not tried the phone number yet however :blink:

IanD,

The shiny-screen MAY not be a problem, if your willing to (or have a tech) restack the screen(s).. There are multiple 'screens' that make up the screen the image is projected onto - including the shiny one. You may be able restack the screen such that the shiny screen is one deeper in the stack..

Cheers,

Bitey

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I don’t think it will be practical to restack the screen on the Hitachi as the protective shiny outer screen goes out to the very edge of the Bessel and appears to be glued in from the front.

The lenticulare screen is attached by screw clamps from the rear.

Unless you have an uncontrolled light source directly opposite the screen, like an uncurtained window behind you viewing position, the reflective screen should not be a big problem.

I personally prefer the shiny screen as it adds depth to the image and is probably tinted to improve blacks.

The blacks on the Hitachi are very good. In fact I have never seen any display with better blacks.

Regards,

Owen

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Owen,

Theres a process on Keohi that describes restacking a hitachi - obviously for a different model - thats for clearing that up! (although I am dissapoined, as im still in limbo regarding my toshiba, and hitachi was next on my list)..

In my situation, I have light from 3 sides!! (a fish tank on to the side, 3-4M of sliding door/glass on the other side, and a doorway almost directly behind to my other lounge of which the back-side is all windows/glass sliding door).. I _need_ an antireflective screen :-) - I do agree with you tho, the antireflective screens DO effect image quality by their very nature of diffusing the light.

Cheers,

Bitey

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Owen,

According to the Imaging Science website, there are 2 in australia:

Pro Image Media Systems Lockleys, SA

Weststate Audio Video Systems Maida Vale

I cant find any reference to 'pro image' here in SA - ive not tried the phone number yet however :blink:

I remember looking at the ISF site sometime last year and they also had a place in Brisbane that was listed as doing it. So I emailed they to ask if they knew anyone reliable in Sydney and kindly never replied...

Perhaps you may be lucky with Pro Image in SA, that is if they aren't limited to commercial customers. I'd drop them a line and find out. Perhaps they even know firms in other states who may have the capabilities to do ISF quality cal. but haven't bothered to register on the US ISF website.

If you do get to talk to them, please let us know what you find out...

Regards,

Oz

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You may have noticed people complaining about not being able to view a 50” HD Plasma from 2.5 meters due to poor picture quality. Well I view my 57” from 2.8 meters and have amazing picture quality with good HD source and very good quality with DVD’s, partly due to the HTPC I use to upscale.

99.5% of people have never seen a properly set up CRT RPTV and can have absolutely no idea of how good they can be.

Unfortunately, unlike the US, where CRT RPTV’s are very widely used and professional calibration services are readily available, I am not aware of anyone offering this service in Australia.

You are SO correct here. I get great PQ from my 47 inch panasonic HD CRT RPTV, but i have never seen the same TV look anywhere near as good in store... In fact they usually look really average.

I've done the service level calibration etc myself.

I can sit well inside 2 meters and still get a great picture....

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Thanks everyone, especially Owen, for the comments about the Hitachi RPTV. As of yesterday I am now the proud owner of the c57 model. Have adjusted my settings to those suggested Nitin though I have reduced the colour by a few more notches. This has made a vast improvement on the original settings. I'm now waiting for a technician to come out and fine tune the rest of the TV for me.

If anyone is interested in buying one of these TVs then they might be pleasantly surprised. According to my friend who sold my the TV, the c57 set has come down $800 in price over the last month. A month ago he quoted me $4400; I just paid $3600 yesterday. What a bargain.

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Thanks everyone, especially Owen, for the comments about the Hitachi RPTV. As of yesterday I am now the proud owner of the c57 model. Have adjusted my settings to those suggested Nitin though I have reduced the colour by a few more notches. This has made a vast improvement on the original settings. I'm now waiting for a technician to come out and fine tune the rest of the TV for me.

If anyone is interested in buying one of these TVs then they might be pleasantly surprised. According to my friend who sold my the TV, the c57 set has come down $800 in price over the last month. A month ago he quoted me $4400; I just paid $3600 yesterday. What a bargain.

Thats a hell of a price!! specially compared to the Toshiba

Cheers,

Bitey

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Bigal,

I recommend that you wait until you get at least 100 hours on the Hitachi before getting the tech out to tweak it.

Make sure that you disable edge enhancement (SVM) for all picture modes as I discussed in an earlier post. Menu items 147,149,150

The only thing the tech should need to do that you cannot is adjust the gray scale for the “Cool” mode (menu items 45-49) to get the colour right.

The “Normal” and “Warm” modes have separate adjustments that use the “Cool” mode settings as a base, and apply a modifying factor to the Cool settings.

These settings are undocumented and are menu items 50-59 and you don’t need to change them.

You will also need to do a service level convergence. This is easy to do yourself if you get the service manual.

Keep your Contrast set as low as possible (about 25-30 range).

Turn down the Sharpness for low quality inputs.

You should also use the “Natural” or “Theater” modes for good quality or HD inputs as this avoids any picture processing by the TV and will be cleaner.

You will notice that all the so called picture enhancement options such as “Noise reduction” and “Colour Management” are not available in these modes.

Have fun with your new toy.

At $3500 the Hitachi must be the best value HD TV available, and if correctly set up, can attain picture quality as good as anything available, regardless of price.

Regards,

Owen

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 4 weeks later...

Hi guys,

I've just done a full Manual Convergence of the 47" Hitachi. Looking good!

Can someone please give me step by step instructions on how to turn off the Edge enhancement?

Thanks :blink:)

To disable edge enhancement on all inputs;

Enter service menu and set menu items:

147 to 0 and press Enter to save

148 to 0 and press Enter to save

149 to 0 and press Enter to save

150 to 0 and press Enter to save

Turn TV off or press Menu button to exit service mode.

Re enter service menu and check that values have been save correctly.

Regards,

Owen

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Read the manual dude.

I feel I should not post that information, as it may encourage people without the service manual to play around.

Accessing the service menu without the manual is VERY hazardous, as the Hitachi menu is quit unfriendly, with no plain English used.

All menu items are only numbered from 0 to over 600.

Regards,

Owen

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You are a bad, bad boy playing around without knowing what you doing FIRST.

The remote has many functions that are not obvious, so stay the hell out of there until you have read and understand the manual.

Convergence needs to be done for each video mode, not each input.

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First time Poster :}

Looking at purchasing the C57 in the next day or so in Perth. JB Hifi in Cannington is the place that put me onto it. Went in there to buy a Projector....... What a fool I could have easily been.

Anyone know a retailer in Perth I should go and see about the best deal.

AND THEN come the nagging questions to the forum about setup and calibration and the getting YELLED AT about touching something I shouldn't have ...... Oh what fun the next 2 weeks will be.

Jason

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  • 1 month later...

Hi Owen

After reading the thread attached to this post I decided to order the C47WD5000. Then, after ordering and reading a subsequent post, manged to change the order (at no cost) to a C47WD7000, mainly because of the PC RGB input and the USB input.

However, the C47WD7000 seems to suffer from the same poor factor settings as the C47WD5000. I've changed the settings to those posted by nitin, which is an improvement, but will experiment some more.

My question is, when you say remove the lower front panel, you do mean the whole front speaker grill, which on the C47WD7000 is 12 screws?

Also, according to the manual and my initial trials, the USB connector does not accept a USB memory stick as I had hoped, but requires the connection of a camera or a card reader! What's the difference between a USB memory stick and a USB card reader??

Another question is that when the set is turned off, there appears to be a white discoloured spot about the size of a saucer at the top centre of the screen, any advice if this is an issue? Many thanks for the info in the previous posts.

Kearns5,

The first thing you should do is turn down the Contrast control to about 25.

The default setting is WAY too high and will potentially damage the CRT’s and give you eye strain.

You then adjust the Brightness control so that blacks are only just black , but not gray.

Convergence adjustment is easy to do, but you will need to remove the lower front panel to get at the service convergence button. It only requires a few screws be removed.

You can get a service manual here:

http://www.hcsd.com.au/html.html

You can hire for about $17 per month or purchase for about $90.

I can tell you how to get into the service menu and disable edge enhancement, but correcting colour will be very difficult without a colour analyzer.

Any good service tech should have a colour analyzer and understand how to use it to adjust gray scale. All CRT displays need this adjustment.

Disabling edge enhancement, correcting colour balance and perfect convergence are very important for a top quality picture.

Once these adjustments are done the Hitachi will be fare more impressive then the little Sony CRT.

It is best to let the TV run in for about 100 hours before doing a calibration.

Regards,

Owen

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Gday newby,

I don’t know anything about the 7000 and have not ever seen one.

The first thing I want to stress is, don’t attempt to get into the service menu or adjust ANYTHING without FIRST obtaining, reading and understanding the service manual. To do so is EXTREAMLLY foolish.

I don’t mind helping people out, but I don’t want to help them get themselves in the sh*t.

You must also take note of all original menu settings BEFORE you change anything.

Also the insides of CRT TV’s have VERY dangerous high voltages (over 30,000 volts), so if you do not know what you are doing you could kill yourself. YOU HAVE BEEN WORNED.

Now that I have got the lecture over and done with, if the 7000 is like the 5000, the main problems with setup are edge enhancement or SVM (Scan Velocity Modulation) and colour temperature (grey scale).

SVM can be disabled in the service menu but it is not documented correctly and is not easy to find.

Colour adjustment is a can of worms and requires experience, skill and patients.

As a start, get the service manual and send me a copy of the service menu listings so I can compare it to the 5000 and see if I can find the settings you need to change.

Regards,

Owen

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I recently purchased the older C47WD5000 and managed to achieve a satisfactory picture without purchasing the service manual. If you set the Picture Mode setting to "Favorite" then there is another page of picture options available, just scroll down past the "Reset" option. If you set all of these options to "Off" then the PQ is improved dramatically. There is one option in particular that is simply called VM which I suspect is the Edge Enhancement feature that Owen mentioned. Turning this off has a big impact.

After disabling VM I found I could raise the level of sharpness back to zero (from negative 30 or something) and improve the PQ further without introducing weird artifacts.

The colour settings could probably be improved with the service manual as some shades of red and blue are overly bright. However, I'd probably make things worse once I started playing with it. I also found the auto-focus did a satisfactory job with the convergence and I have only a small amount of colour fringing towards the outer edge of the screen, which is not noticeable at normal viewing distance.

I paid only $2370 for this beast and I have to say it one of the best purchases I ever made. If it weren't for Owen's comments on this forum I probably wouldn't have given it a second glance in the store!

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Glad you are happy with your Hitachi Snoozer, but I have to tell you that you have not seen it working at more then 70% of it’s potential.

You can play around in the user menu as much as you like, but you will never get what I consider a top class picture.

Edge enhancement cannot be disabling in the user menu, and the colour adjustments are next to useless.

The service level manual convergence is MUCH better then the Magic auto convergence system.

Add in some other tweaks like removing overscan, geometry errors, optical and electrostatic focus and lens striping and you transform an ordinary image into one that a HD Plasma cannot match.

Unless you have seen a fully tweaked CRT RPTV, it is difficult to imagine just how good the picture can be.

Owen

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Glad you are happy with your Hitachi Snoozer, but I have to tell you that you have not seen it working at more then 70% of it’s potential.

You can play around in the user menu as much as you like, but you will never get what I consider a top class picture.

Edge enhancement cannot be disabling in the user menu, and the colour adjustments are next to useless.

The service level manual convergence is MUCH better then the Magic auto convergence system.

Add in some other tweaks like removing overscan, geometry errors, optical and electrostatic focus and lens striping and you transform an ordinary image into one that a HD Plasma cannot match.

Unless you have seen a fully tweaked CRT RPTV, it is difficult to imagine just how good the picture can be.

Owen

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Owen,

I bought the C57-WD5000 3 months ago and also purchased the service manual from HCSD. I have change the settings in menu'1 147, 148,149,150 to 0 and still not yet done a manual convergence. Is there any other settings which I can play around with to acheive better picture quality.

Thanks

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  • 1 month later...

I just bought a C57-WD5000 a few months ago on layby, was to pick it up last week but they stopped selling that model and have upgraded me to the C57-WD7000.

My question is, has anyone seen the difference between these 2 models. in person?

I know rule of thumb is, newer model should be better, with more features, but thats not always the case.

I paid $3400. plus I bought a hd set top box and a few other things which was extra.

any advice would be great

thanks in advance

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I think my hitachi needs to be converged again, I cant be bothered doing a manual convergence for now (it took me ages last time) so I tried the magic focus button.

But no matter if I press it for one second or hold it down, it keeps going into static mode rather than starting the magic focus. any ideas?

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on the subject of crt,can anyone enighten me on colour temp,warm.std etc.thanks for any info stubbey.

The cool setting is the best, but even cool is WAY to warm with VERY excessive red output on my Hitachi and others that I have seen.

Colour is a BIG problem on the Hitachi and the gray scale needs to be completely readjusted in the service menu with the aid of measurement equipment.

The user menu colour adjustments can not fix the problem as they are for the colour decoder, not the RGB level gains and cuts.

Cop ya later,

Owen

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apollox goods buy buddy the new one has 12 point convergance instead of i think it was 9 point it also has the remot blaster great feature if you want to lock your equipment away and i think it also has manual convergence aswell

and has usb input i could go on all day

but there is one sad part its the last of the 57 crt rptv from hitachi there pulling the pin on the 57 i guess do to price there must be more money in a 6000-11000 plasma than a 3000 HUGE rptv ie transport and so on

but be sure it kicks the 57" 800 pana all over the room...lol :blink:

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Yes he should.

Other things to attend to are.

1. Reduce overscan.

2. Electron beam and lens focus.

3. Adjust geometry.

4. Full 117 point manual convergence

5. Disable Velocity Scan Modulation (edge enhancement) for all modes in service menu (VERY IMPORTANT)

6. Apply lens strips to equalize colour across the screen

And if you really won’t to get serious, line the interior of the cabinet with light absorbing cloth.

With all this done correctly, the Hitachi will provide a remarkable image that cant be bettered by current digital displays of comparable size.

Owen

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hi,the57wd7000 is going for $2500 in perth,i wonder if this tv has the same quality as the 5000 model,it is made in china,as a lot of tv's are,owen is the 5000 made in japan?because the 7000 seems like bloody good value to me.cheers stubbey.

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The 5000 is also made in China.

I have not seen a 7000, so I cant be sure it is as good as a 5000, but they most likely are.

Get em while they last boys, cos there on a run out sale.

I have owned the 57” 5000 for over a year and am considering purchasing a 47” for another room before they disappear.

Regards,

Owen

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hi,the57wd7000 is going for $2500 in perth,i wonder if this tv has the same quality as the 5000 model,it is made in china,as a lot of tv's are,owen is the 5000 made in japan?because the 7000 seems like bloody good value to me.cheers stubbey.

what shop was this in stubbey?

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I paid only $2370 for this beast and I have to say it one of the best purchases I ever made.  If it weren't for Owen's comments on this forum I probably wouldn't have given it a second glance in the store!

Was that new? If so, can you tell us where?

It was floorstock from JB Hifi in Osborne Park, Perth. I was a bit uncomfortable about taking stock from the floor, but with the money I saved I got a five year warranty. It was only $200 extra and put my mind at ease somewhat.

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...

You can play around in the user menu as much as you like, but you will never get what I consider a top class picture.

Edge enhancement cannot be disabling in the user menu, and the colour adjustments are next to useless.

The service level manual convergence is MUCH better then the Magic auto convergence system.

...

Owen

Even though I'm happy with the auto-focus and can't seem to notice the edge enhancement, I must admit the colours on the Hitachi are getting to me. If I got my hands on the service manual is it difficult to adjust the colour levels without specialised equipment? Would it be possible for you to post your own colour settings here so that I could enter them in?

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It is VERY difficult, if not imposable to adjust the grey scale (colour) without instruments.

You can do a reasonable job by eye if you know what you are doing, but you can also get yourself in trouble if you don’t.

My setting would be useless, as I have done so many adjustments and modifications away from standard on my Hitachi.

When I can find the time, I will write a guide on how to adjust grey scale using basic, commonly available equipment.

Getting the convergence perfect with the service mode manual adjustments does not make a huge difference for SD video, but for HD, the difference IS huge.

Edge enhancement on the Hitachi is about the worst I have seen. I don’t know how you can’t see it.

The picture as delivered, is quite hideous, mostly due to Velocity Scan Modulation (edge enhancement).

It’s really noticeable on computer text with a HTPC, very ugly.

Unless you have seen a CRT RPTV working properly, it is difficult to understand just how good they can be.

Owen

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